Allansian Sorcery

Advanced Fighting Fantasy discussion
Post Reply
darksoul
Knight
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:15 am

Allansian Sorcery

Post by darksoul » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:49 am

I've pondered on this for a while. Answer was right in my face all along.
As taught by Yaztromo in Temple of Terror, Allansian Sorcery.

Open Door - 2 stamina
Creature Sleep - 1 stamina
Magic Arrow - 2 stamina
Language - 1 stamina
Read Symbols - 1 stamina
Light - 2 stamina
Fire - 1 or 2 stamina
Jump - 3 stamina
Detect Magic - 2 stamina
Create Water - No cost

HedgeWizard
Knight
Posts: 361
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:20 pm

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by HedgeWizard » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:35 am

I must admit that I don’t have an extensive knowledge of the Sorcery spells. Is this a subset or a different list?

Are you suggesting that there is a different tradition of Sorcery which has grown in Allansia after it was introduced from the Old World?

darksoul
Knight
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by darksoul » Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:52 am

HedgeWizard wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:35 am
I must admit that I don’t have an extensive knowledge of the Sorcery spells. Is this a subset or a different list?

Are you suggesting that there is a different tradition of Sorcery which has grown in Allansia after it was introduced from the Old World?
Different List.
II'd say that Allansia already had it's own kind of Sorcery before the Sorcery of Analand made it's way there.
Interestingly enough you could make the assertion that this magic grew out of Analandian Sorcery of you consider the book release dates as chronological.
Shamutanti Hills was released in 1983 and The Temple of Terror Was Released in 1985. I don't know if that means the stories happen in that order in the world of titan though. Fun to speculate.
But, yeah, I'd treat it as a different list that arose on it's own in Allansia and before Analandian sorcery was spread.

HedgeWizard
Knight
Posts: 361
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:20 pm

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by HedgeWizard » Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:06 am

Nice! Do you have the spell effects?

I’ve always stayed away from Sorcerer characters because of the need to learn the long list of spells but this presents a nice alternative: Short list and with its own backstory.

HedgeWizard
Knight
Posts: 361
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:20 pm

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by HedgeWizard » Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:06 am

For the chronology I don’t think those two have a strict in universe chronology, anyone else know?

Nuvole!
Archmage
Posts: 1248
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2013 6:06 pm

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by Nuvole! » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:50 pm

darksoul wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:52 am
Interestingly enough you could make the assertion that this magic grew out of Analandian Sorcery of you consider the book release dates as chronological.
Shamutanti Hills was released in 1983 and The Temple of Terror Was Released in 1985. I don't know if that means the stories happen in that order in the world of titan though. Fun to speculate.
In general, that's not valid for FF gamebooks. There are a few FF gamebooks that can be put in a clear order (the super-classic trilogy is Caverns of the Snow Witch - Forest of Doom - Temple of Terror, but there are some more) and they were not published in that chronological order. That's part of FF flavour.
I'm the real Nowhere man, sitting in my Nowhere land, making all my Nowhere plans for Nobody.

User avatar
SkinnyOrc
Hero
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:53 am
Contact:

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by SkinnyOrc » Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:04 am

Temple of Terror is still on my bookshelf waiting for me. Just curious, in it Yaztromo describes what he's teaching as sorcery? Does it have any of the characteristics of normal sorcery like physical spell components and costing STAM? Maybe they're wizardry spells and he just calls it sorcery? If it really is sorcery then it's a short list. But I never completely bought that the Sorcery books told us you learnt all of them as a block. The hero could just have been an experienced sorcerer who knew a lot of spells.

darksoul
Knight
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by darksoul » Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:39 pm

Nuvole! wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:50 pm
darksoul wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:52 am
Interestingly enough you could make the assertion that this magic grew out of Analandian Sorcery of you consider the book release dates as chronological.
Shamutanti Hills was released in 1983 and The Temple of Terror Was Released in 1985. I don't know if that means the stories happen in that order in the world of titan though. Fun to speculate.
In general, that's not valid for FF gamebooks. There are a few FF gamebooks that can be put in a clear order (the super-classic trilogy is Caverns of the Snow Witch - Forest of Doom - Temple of Terror, but there are some more) and they were not published in that chronological order. That's part of FF flavour.
True. It occurs to me that the magic in Sorcery may have influenced the magic system used in Temple of Terror since ToT came after Sorcery. I'm not talking about in world influence. I mean in the real world. Ian may have decided he liked the magic in Sorcery and wanted to do something similar.

darksoul
Knight
Posts: 325
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by darksoul » Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:13 pm

SkinnyOrc wrote:
Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:04 am
Temple of Terror is still on my bookshelf waiting for me. Just curious, in it Yaztromo describes what he's teaching as sorcery? Does it have any of the characteristics of normal sorcery like physical spell components and costing STAM? Maybe they're wizardry spells and he just calls it sorcery? If it really is sorcery then it's a short list. But I never completely bought that the Sorcery books told us you learnt all of them as a block. The hero could just have been an experienced sorcerer who knew a lot of spells.
He does describe it. It's pretty straight forward though.
Most are exactly what you expect them to be. None of the spell require components.
They do cost Stamina. I listed that on my first post :)
Spell then Stamina Cost.
I don't think Steve or Ian had planned on two different magic systems in a unified world. It wasn't until out of the pit that we got a map of Allansia iirc.
It could be wizardry but since AFF2 has 3 different kinds of magic I think it's nice that this can fit into the category of Sorcery.
Based on AFF2's game mechanics this could mean that Yaztromo is is both a wizard and a Sorcerer


The only spells that stand out are
Fire - you either create a wall of fire around yourself or use it to light a small torch. The amount of Stamina used depends on how you use the spell
Jump- lets you jump over high walls. It's super jumping. Also the most expensive of all the spells.
Read Symbols-Let's you read runes or magic symbols
Detect Trap - Warns you of any trap before you. You still have t bypass it though.
Magic Arrow- Shoots a magic dart from your finger. I have to look through the book to find the damage.

Since this is the third book in the Trilogy, the character has never exhibited magic before till now.

User avatar
SkinnyOrc
Hero
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:53 am
Contact:

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by SkinnyOrc » Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:14 pm

Yeah I wasn't sure if those STAM numbers were from the book or what you'd come up with. What other FF gamebooks had spellcasting (I'm not counting Scorpion Swamp and its spell gems)?

I think you're right that were was no intention for wizardry and sorcery to be different back then, they were just experimenting with various mechanics for magic. The hero in Citadel of Chaos is wearing leather armour and their spells don't cost STAM. Of course by the AFF2 rules someone who knows wizardry can do that, they just use an extra MP each spell.

As you said, the Sorcery books came first. Temple of Terror was published in '85, two years after The Shamutanti Hills. I had a look at ToT and I don't see Yaztromo calling it sorcery, but it does seem Ian was influenced by the Sorcery system here.
Last edited by SkinnyOrc on Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:42 am, edited 2 times in total.

Chompy
Posts: 58
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2019 7:30 am

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by Chompy » Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:19 am

Clash of Princes springs to mind. The Warlock's Way uses a MAGIC attribute as a fourth statistic, casting spells comes from there instead of from your STAMINA.

The spells are described as Battle Spells and the list includes:
WEAKEN, CLUMSY, DEATH BLAST, ZAP, SLEEP, BEFUDDLE, NIMBLE, STRENGTH, EMPOWER, AURA OF INVINCIBILITY, SHADE, RESTORE.

Makes me wonder if it might have anything to do with the upcoming Combat Magic, or not.

User avatar
Andrew Wright
Posts: 56
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:25 am

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by Andrew Wright » Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:49 am

Great minds think alike!

I'm including both the spells from Citadel of Chaos and Temple of Terror in Encyclopedia Arcana: Volume 1 (currently 75K words and almost there).

They'll be in an Appendix for a new magical style called: Demi-Sorcery.

The color text reads:
New Magical Special Skills

Magic-Demi-Sorcery

Introduction
This rare magical school is a hybrid of both Wizardry and Sorcery magical styles. Its emphasis is on speed, simplicity and effectiveness. Demi-Sorcery may be learned by Wizards or Sorcerers in addition to their other spellcasting abilities. It was first developed at the School of Yore in the forest of the same name, although the exact history of Demi-Sorcery is difficult to pin down. Some claim Erridansis Whitewolf, the founder of Yore itself, developed Demi-Sorcery as a tool to differentiate different potentialities of apprentice intakes into separate Wizardry and Sorcery streams. Others state that no less than the current Grand Wizard Vermithrax Moonchaser created the school of Demi-Sorcery in order to supply surrounding city-states with puissant, quick-thinking magi who could help stem the dark tides of Chaos that lap at the frayed edges of the savage land of Allansia. Whatever the source, Demi-Sorcery can be practiced in its own right, as well as in preparation for an induction into the further arcane secrets of either Wizardry or Sorcery. Some even claim that Balthus Dire, Lord of Craggen Rock and the Black Tower, was initially a Demi-Sorcerer before his father sent him into the Flatlands to study Demonology and Necromancy under the feared Volgera Darkstorm.

Practitioners
Demi-Sorcerers are practical people, who generally eschew the arcane trappings and rituals of Wizardry, or the manifold components required for Sorcery. Instead, their magic is fast, direct and effective; often complimenting other talents the Demi-Sorcerer may possess, such as swordplay, stealth or woodcraft. Of course, there are drawbacks, and an emphasis on speed means that the spells available to Demi-Sorcerers lack the potency and might of other schools of magic. Nevertheless, even some Wizards and Sorcerers learn this art, if only as a backup for when their other spells fail them and their cantrips lack the requisite power and ambition.
The magic system from Clash of the Princes will eventually be in Volume 2 and include all the spells you cast in the Warlock's Way gamebook.

User avatar
SkinnyOrc
Hero
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:53 am
Contact:

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by SkinnyOrc » Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:09 am

Andrew Wright wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:49 am
Encyclopedia Arcana: Volume 1
Ah hah! You let slip the name of the upcoming magic book, we don't normally get info like that until it's practically in our hands! ;)

Demi-Sorcery sounds like a good approach for those spells, it explains why they're Sorcery like but also different. It'll offer some interesting character combinations if you can mix it with Wizardry. Demi-Sorcery can be the form Sorcery took in Allansia, if you treat the normal form as something known only to foreigners there.

HedgeWizard
Knight
Posts: 361
Joined: Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:20 pm

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by HedgeWizard » Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:57 pm

That’s a nice surprise, looking forward to seeing this come out! What will be in the complete volume?

User avatar
SkinnyOrc
Hero
Posts: 754
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2014 10:53 am
Contact:

Re: Allansian Sorcery

Post by SkinnyOrc » Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:19 am

This is the info we got on the magic items book earlier. The post just after that though seemed to be describing more a treasure book. Wondering if these are one and the same or different books?

Post Reply