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Night Dragon locations

Posted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:51 am
by Slloyd14
Hi gang!

I'm trying to convert Night Dragon to an AFF adventure and I was wondering if I could get help from the Advanced Fighting Fantasy hive mind - can anyone tell me the locations of Rentarn, Carnex, Ismater, the giants' village, the dragon conclave, Sharndale, the Mist Crypts, the Great Mine and the Night Dragon's lair? I could probably work them out based on the book, hut I was wondering if someone had already made a map. I also want to compare their locations to where the Snow Witch lives (as she has a dragon who might have information) and the area around Sardath (as the heroes could get help from Corinthus the storm giant, the ranger who is the hero of the book or even the dark elves)

Many thanks!!!

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:46 am
by HedgeWizard
I don’t know Night Dragon so I can’t help you. Any reason for wanting to fit it in Titan rather than using AFF rules with the alternative setting?

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:43 pm
by Slloyd14
Sorry, didn't clarify - Night Dragon is FF 52 and it's set in the northwest part of Allansia. I've started going through locations based on directions and how long it takes to travel. I also want to incorporate Yaztromo into it.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:46 pm
by HedgeWizard
Oops I feel ashamed for missing that one!

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:59 pm
by HedgeWizard
Just looking at Titanica i got the following since I don’t have the book.

The locations are north of Blacksand, Marzail is a village a few days hard walking north of Blacksand and is half way to Rentarn which is on Corpse Bay. Sharndale is just south of Rentarn.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:02 pm
by JoeDuncan
This is from "The Atlas of Titan":

Marzail:
"Heading north through Port Blacksand’s Weaver Gate, the Coast Road travels for many leagues beside the grey Western Ocean. 'Days of determined marching‛ will lead a traveller to the small village of Marzail, where there is a small inn that serves hot food."

Sharndale:
"Beyond Marzail, the rugged, undulating terrain through which the Coast Road travels stretches out northwards, passing by copses of pine woods...
Beyond the woods, a thirteen-mile side-track leads east to the village of Sharndale. Trappers use the village as a base, as they drive their dogsleds into the frosty wilderness in search of animal pelts..."

Rentarn:
"The Coast Road continues around the coastline of Corpse Bay to the town of Rentarn. It is a trading outpost where fur-trappers and hunters mix with fishermen and some Sword Coast pirates."

Storm Drake Pass:
"To the north-northwest of Rentarn is the bleak Stormdrake Pass. As it grows narrower, 'the peaks of the Dragon Reaches margin begin to ascend round it.‛"

Ismater:
"The northwest track leads to Ismater, 'the last civilized town in the Dragon Reaches.‛ It is 'a large village nestling in the foothills of the forbidding northern and eastern mountains';"

All this would place the Night Dragon locations in the area called the "Dragon Reaches" and the environs immediately south of it. The Dragon Reaches are the hilly peninsula and archipelago in the far north west of Allansia, west of the Icefinger mts. Whether "Dragon Reaches" refers to the hill/mountain chain, the peninsula and archipelago itself or is a political label for the region is unclear.

I would guess that "Corpse Bay" is the large bite out of north-west allansia that forms the southern side of the neck of the large peninsula in the Dragon Reaches. Storm Drake pass could be somewhere on the neck of the peninsula. The northern and eastern mountains must refer to the Icefinger mountains. I'd also guess that the "Sword Coast" is the coast along north-west Allansia north of the River Kok and along the archipelago of the Dragon Reaches.

It says Marzail is 'days of marching' north from Blacksand on the "Coast Road"; but it never mentions crossing the Red River or Kaylong marsh on the Kok river, or anything about passing Kaad or Ekaad. However Marzail would have the be north of those locations for the rest of the location descriptions to make sense; so we have to assume those were included in the 'days of marching' and just skipped over. The city map of Kaad shows a road leading north that says "to Icefinger mts.", so either the Coast Road goes through Kaad, or the road north out of Kaad joins up with the Coast Road.

The town of Ismater must be inland a little bit, as it is north of Rentarn which lies on Corpse Bay, but there are directions to mountains and caves both to the north west and south west of Ismater. Carnex is a days walk north of Ismater.

So it looks like the Night Dragon locations are in far north-west Allansia, in and around the Dragon Reaches and Icefinger mountains, north of Tanglewood Forest, the Kok river, Kaylong Marsh and Ekaad. Carnex seems to be the largest city, and Rentarn the main port.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:27 pm
by HedgeWizard
Is there any description of Carnex? Because you say Ismater is the last civilised place and that Carnex is north of it, but then say Carnex is the main town.

Or have I missed something?

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:09 am
by JoeDuncan
HedgeWizard wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:27 pm
Is there any description of Carnex? Because you say Ismater is the last civilised place and that Carnex is north of it, but then say Carnex is the main town.

Or have I missed something?
Nope that was my bad, I cut off the bit about Carnex while cutting and pasting, apparently! Here's the bit about Carnex from the "Coast Road" entry in Atlas of Titan:

"A day’s journey to the north of Ismater, the road forks, with a southwestern spur leading to the grim, walled town of Carnex. To the east side is a single closed gate, manned by brutish guards. ‚The town is broadly divided in half, with the bigger houses and those of the merchants to the north and the homes of ordinary labourers and artisans to the south.‛Unlike most towns, the two taverns on the south side of town are quiet, filled with nervous people. A large guarded brewery supposedly producing fine ale is in the southwest. The gardens to the northwest are ‚pretty and elegant.‛ A sluice to drain the lily pond also leads down to the sewers. The graveyards to the northeast are huge, filled with vaults and crypts. The group of three towers standing behind a curtain wall are well guarded. High Priest Scalmagzaprin dwells in the tallest, central tower"

From the descriptions of both towns Carnex just seemed like the bigger place, particularly since it has a wall, gates and sewers, while Ismater is described more simply as a "large town nestled in the foothills". Personally I interpreted the "last civilized place" qualifier on Ismater to mean that it's a fairly lawful place compared to Carnex which seems like a more "corrupt" and chaotic place like Blacksand or Khare.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:14 am
by JoeDuncan
Here's the full Atlas entry for Ismater as well, if you'd like to compare them yourself:

"The northwest track leads to Ismater, ‚the last civilized town in the Dragon Reaches.‛ It is 'a large village nestling in the foothills of the forbidding northern and eastern mountains; herders, fur-trappers, nomadic hillsmen, merchants, and even a handful of Barbarian warriors make it a lively place.‛

The town has two unusual shops. The Firewater Emporium has 'a window stacked full of exotic bottles.‛ Its Gnome proprietor sells many spirits, including Larssen’s Firewater, the best in the north. The second is 'a very dirty and run-down little shop‛, inside of which is 'a confusion of rubbish.' 'Stuffed animal heads and rugs hang from the walls and shelves are packed with glass bottles containing rather disgusting things in coloured fluids.‛ This junk shop is Nevill’s store, 'a wizened, little, middle-aged man with lank, greasy hair and a pair of pince-nez glasses perched on top of his huge beaky nose.‛ He is a consummate hoarder. Ismater’s taverns are 'none too clean, with a clientele somewhere between disreputable and repulsive.'"

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:49 am
by JoeDuncan
JoeDuncan wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 1:09 am
The group of three towers standing behind a curtain wall are well guarded.
From perusing the actual paragraphs in the Night Dragon book, it's clear that the three towers of Carnex are on the north side of town, inside the main town wall, but separated from the rest of the town by a curtain wall with a guarded gate.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:52 am
by JoeDuncan
Slloyd14 wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:51 am
can anyone tell me the locations of ... the giants' village...
According to the Atlas the land of the frost giants is:
"A day’s journey East of Ismater, into the high foothills that border the mountains, is the land of the Jublez, the Frost Giants. These fur-clad six-metre-tall behemoths herd goats in the shallow valleys."

So they'd be in the western foothills of the Icefingers.
Slloyd14 wrote:
Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:51 am
I also want to compare their locations to where the Snow Witch lives (as she has a dragon who might have information) and the area around Sardath (as the heroes could get help from Corinthus the storm giant, the ranger who is the hero of the book or even the dark elves)
Sardath is almost on the other side of the continent (further east than Zengis), bordering Vynheim in the east and the Freezeblood mts in the north. There won't be any interaction with Corinthus unless you want your PCs to treck halfway across the continent!

Again from the Atlas, this is the rough location of the Crystal Caves (the Snow Witch's lair):
"The River Kok is two days’ arduous journey from the Crystal Caves (here incorrectly labelled Crystal Caverns). This point [1] is fifty miles downriver from Fang—a point which is clearly in error. For once, it would seem the original source material is incorrect, and it should read that Fang lies downriver from this point."

So they're roughly 50 miles east (upriver) along the Kok from Fang, and then two days journey north into the Icefingers. This still puts the lair of the Snow Witch quite aways east of the Dragon Reaches. The Crystal Caves are actually in the Icefingers, while even the land of the frost giants is described as still being in the foothills. To get from the Dragon Reaches to the Snow Witch, you PCs would either have to head south to the Fang<->Zengis road and then back north into the Icefingers 50 miles upriver after Fang OR go straight east up into the Icefingers and cross the Frozen Plateau which is not likely an easy journey.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:14 pm
by JoeDuncan
JoeDuncan wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:52 am
This still puts the lair of the Snow Witch quite aways east of the Dragon Reaches.
On second thought, the distance from the Dragon Reaches to the Crystal Caves appears to be roughly the same as the distance from Blacksand to the Dragon Reaches, so it should be doable to include the Snow Witch.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:01 pm
by HedgeWizard
Sounds like a fun area to do some adventuring, although I can’t imagine how would be best to link the Snow Witch into it. Unless you were starting at Fang and getting information from her dragon before then heading the Dragon Reaches.

Re: Night Dragon locations

Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:53 pm
by Yaztromo
JoeDuncan wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:52 am
Again from the Atlas, this is the rough location of the Crystal Caves (the Snow Witch's lair):
"The River Kok is two days’ arduous journey from the Crystal Caves (here incorrectly labelled Crystal Caverns). This point [1] is fifty miles downriver from Fang—a point which is clearly in error. For once, it would seem the original source material is incorrect, and it should read that Fang lies downriver from this point."
What makes you write that's clearly an error, Joe?
For me we cross the Kok west of Fang and not east of the town.
Ian Livingstone wrote in Caverns of Snow-Witch, when we arrive at the Kok (section 104): '50 miles up-river lies Fang'.

And the Caverns or 'ice caverns' are sometimes called Caves in the gamebook too, there's no problem from the atlas, Simon probably only re-used the 2 versions of the name.
section 67: 'the legendary Crystal Caves' and 81: 'in search of the Crystal Caves' (3 occurrencies, then I don't think that's a bug).

And great news that Stuart is working on a AFF adaptation of Night Dragon!
I think all the geographical informations were given there.