Order of Events

nicholaslim
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Order of Events

Postby nicholaslim » Sat Jul 06, 2013 8:06 pm

How is everyone else handling the order of events in combat? According to the AFF core, on page 58, It says that the effects of missile weapon attacks are resolved first, followed by magical spells or items and then any hand-to-hand attacks.

Are you handling this order of events sequentially? Or considering them all happening simultaneously?

A scenario here: A hero with the wizardry ability is attempting to cast a spell (assuming that the spell in question is Death) at another hero in a distance (less than 5 metres away) equipped with a bow. This hero with the bow notches an arrow and shoots at the wizardry hero. Since the order of events requires resolution of the range attack first and if the hero succeeded in shooting the wizardry hero, does it affect the spell casting? Or the wizardry hero will only get a -1 to his casting?

The rule on page 72 of the AFF core mention "Caster is target of ranged attack"will suffer a -1 to casting. I meant to interpret it as as long as the caster is being targeted but doesn't necessarily meant that the shot is a success or failure.

In conclusion, does it mean that there is no initiative per se but all things happen at the same time - it just a matter of resolving it in sequence?

(In the above scenario, the wizardry hero will suffer a -1 to casting but if he successfully cast the spell even though he is injured by the arrow, he will still have casted Death on his enemy and the archer hero will have been dead)
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d6&d6
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Re: Order of Events

Postby d6&d6 » Sun Jul 07, 2013 4:31 am

nicholaslim wrote:How is everyone else handling the order of events in combat? According to the AFF core, on page 58, It says that the effects of missile weapon attacks are resolved first, followed by magical spells or items and then any hand-to-hand attacks.

Are you handling this order of events sequentially?


For my part, I say yes. I do that this way

nicholaslim wrote:(In the above scenario, the wizardry hero will suffer a -1 to casting but if he successfully cast the spell even though he is injured by the arrow, he will still have casted Death on his enemy and the archer hero will have been dead)


Not exactly if I understand what's written on page 67 (just above the helmet). "Preparation cannot be interupted". I know this part is about preparing a spell longer but for me, any spell cast has a preperation time, the time that missile weapons are shot. My way to do this, the wizard cant cast his Death spell if he's wounded, otherwise, he gets his -1
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torus
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Re: Order of Events

Postby torus » Sun Jul 07, 2013 9:12 am

I think it's easiest if events are handled sequentially, and my interpretation would be the same as d6&d6 - i.e. if the wizard is hit his/her preparation is interrupted. I suppose you could just give an even bigger penalty of -2 to casting rather than say the spell fails outright.

I play with a slight modification to the missile combat rule, in that I require missile attack strength to equal or exceed a target number of 15 (as well as beating the opponent's roll) to hit. This means shots fired at passive, inert or unaware targets can still miss - such targets simply don't make an opposed roll.

Given this, I would allow the wizard the option of not defending the missile attack (staying focused on the spell) and avoiding the automatic -1 penalty. They would still get a -2 penalty if hit.
nicholaslim
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Re: Order of Events

Postby nicholaslim » Sun Jul 07, 2013 6:35 pm

Thanx for the replies! I'll consider what is being mentioned here. Currently, I'm toying with simultaneous actions instead - meaning that the archer hero will shoot and the wizard hero will cast the spell all at the same time. After all, AFF core mentioned that one combat round is approximately 2 seconds. Not much to consider split second sequencing then.

PS: Yet on second thought, this will make spellcaster extremely powerful (especially for spells like Death) if the spell casting cannot be interrupted. But then, melee fighters will never be able to interrupt spells since their action always "come after" spell casting. Hmm.....
johnnybleu
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Re: Order of Events

Postby johnnybleu » Sat Jul 13, 2013 4:19 am

It was my understanding that all actions were simultaneous in a combat round, and that the "order of events" didn't really matter unless it was relevant. To me, in your example, the Wizard would cast his spell with a -1 to his roll (because he is the target of a ranged attack), but his spell would go off. All rolls would be made at the same time, as there is no initiative or "turn". Indeed, if a warrior was attacking that same Wizard in that combat round, the Wizard would have yet another penalty to his roll, even if his spell would technically go off before the warrior's attack.

The only time where the order matters is if the arrow would be fatal. Then, obviously, the spell does not go off. Similarly, if a certain spell would have some impact on the melee portion of the round, then it could be important to know if and when it goes off. Otherwise, I say it's not really important what happens when.

Now, I was not aware that you could actually interrupt a spell with an attack. I never got that from the wording in the book-- only that attacking a caster gives them a penalty to the spellcasting roll. Furthermore, Priests don't even need to make rolls, so aren't even subject to these penalties. A priest of Death is then an absolutely terrifying foe.

Is there an official rule that covers interrupting spells (short of killing the caster with ranged attacks)?

Edit: Also, I thought it was decided in the errata that a combat round was actually 10 seconds. Which one is it?
torus
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Re: Order of Events

Postby torus » Sat Jul 13, 2013 9:45 pm

I think in theory simultaneous resolution would make most sense. It's just that in practice I find it simpler to resolve things sequentially, so that there are never any arguments about which action affect which others. It's more artificial but (for me) easier. Also as you say, for most things it doesn't matter. I don't allow magic users to cast spells if actually engaged in melee, or if they do it's at a penalty and the attacker gets a free hit.

Also I go with ~10s rounds.
johnnybleu
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Re: Order of Events

Postby johnnybleu » Sat Jul 20, 2013 3:22 pm

torus wrote:I don't allow magic users to cast spells if actually engaged in melee, or if they do it's at a penalty and the attacker gets a free hit.


That's almost how I interpret the rules in the book-- minus the free hit. A Wizard casting a spell while in melee combat would get a -2 to his casting roll, and then be attacked. Of course, I'd be inclined to make it a "free" hit like you, since the Wizard is casting and not actively fighting (i.e. does not get a combat roll). I guess it depends on the "flavour" of the game.

I think I would also make magic resolution the last thing, so it would be ranged>melee>magic. For some reason that makes more sense.

Hmmmm... Decisions, decisions.
nicholaslim
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Re: Order of Events

Postby nicholaslim » Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:59 pm

Hmmm...food for thought. I may try with this sequence too - range followed by melee then magic.

Any thoughts on an interrupted spell casting? Meaning that if a wizard/sorcerer was trying to cast a spell and a warrior stepped up and attack the spellcaster successfully dealing damage, will it interrupt the casting and auto fail it?
johnnybleu
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Re: Order of Events

Postby johnnybleu » Mon Jul 22, 2013 11:39 pm

As far as I know, it's impossible to interrupt someone casting a spell short of killing them. I suppose if the players got clever and said they were grabbing the guy, holding him down and covering his mouth that would probably spoil the spell. ;)

Attacking a wizard casting a spell only grants a penalty to his spellcasting roll, which technically makes it more difficult for him. But this applies regardless of whether or not he suffers any damage (indeed, according to the rules the test is made before melee attacks are dealt with). Also, priests don't even need to make a test to cast a spell, so there's absolutely nothing you can do-- making priests of Death insta-kill machines, as I mentioned earlier.

All this said, you could easily implement rules for interrupting a spell being cast by successfully whacking the offending wizard with any choice implement.
nicholaslim
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Re: Order of Events

Postby nicholaslim » Tue Jul 23, 2013 4:22 am

Sounds logical - in D&D genre, a wizard/sorcerer suffering damage during spellcasting will interrupt the spell. Anyway, this is AFF and spellcasting is almost instantaneous.
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Re: Order of Events

Postby Nuvole! » Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:28 am

I do the same: is a magic user is hit before casting the spell, the concentration is broken and the spell aborted.
I give the penalty to the casting roll if the magic user is targeted but not hit (as this lowers her concentration, but doesn't brek it).

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